Introduction: Travis Keller
Interview: Sam Velde, Travis Keller, Tom Apostolopoulos
Band photos: Travis Keller
Pleasure Forever are a modern day Rock N’ Roll band. This band does everything right as far as I’m concerned. They put on a great live show, they write great lyrics, make great artwork for their records (the best this year), have great attitude, great imagery, they’re really good people, and most importantly· great songs. Quite simply, they rock. Pleasure Forever are pure rock lust and they know it, as well as anyone does, how to rock the fuck out of you. They live for that sole purpose, to rock you. And with songs about drugs, orgies, and more drugs, you can’t really go wrong. Can you? We’re usually pretty bad at organizing interviews, but this one takes the cake. Never before have we blown it this bad. No, we didn’t forget to interview them, we actually interviewed Pleasure Forever twice, without even realizing it. First, Sam and Travis sat down with the band over some fine Mexican food in the City of Angels. Then a week later, Tom conducted his interview via email (cuz he didn’t want to drive his purple sports car to the west coast) from the East side of our fine nation. Both of the interviews were so good, (what other band is gonna talk about gay orgies with us?) we decided to combine them into one giant mesh of questions and answers. Hopefully after reading it you’ll realize that you simply need to get down with this sound.
Buddyhead: I’m sure you’ve been asked plenty questions about your past efforts: the VSS and Slaves, and I might want to get into that later, but I want to start off by getting the idea, concept, and explanation of your name, including the reason you changed your name from Slaves to present moniker Pleasure Forever.
Dave: The initial reason for calling the band Slaves was that I thought of it to be used as a side project band name during the time I was in the VSS. It was based on the concept as an artist you’re trying to control all the aspects of the environment that you’re in. You’re creating something that’s coming from all over the room and everyone in the audience are Slaves to it!
Buddyhead: Why would they be Slaves to it?
Dave: Well, you are controlling the way people react to what you are doing. You’re attempting to do that and hoping they’re going to respond in a certain way. It’s a cynical thought. We ended up taking that name after the VSS split because it had a lot of connotations and could be an interesting concept… but we never felt like it really fit. It seemed limited and the connotations seemed to be missed. People sort of took it as the band was called “The Slaves,” it seemed banal and ridiculous.
Andy: Yeah, the VSS would be on tour and we would try to evoke some sort of passion upon people, which is a very hard thing to do, something very difficult to pull out of an audience, instead of just standing there or bobbing their heads. So the name is also a reaction to that obstacle, to the difficulties of that.
Dave: Someone recently said “Wow! It’s such a big jump to go from Slaves to Pleasure Forever.” They were suggesting that was somehow a huge dichotomy, but both names are about paradox, so the idea of Pleasure Forever is something that is Utopian and not a possible kind of ‘thing’, but that’s the poetry of human will. That people want to live life to the fullest and we never really can. That’s beautiful to me, the tragedy.
Andy: Tears of a clown!
Dave: That’s all part of our ‘thing’. Andy’s lyrics tend to lean towards that idea. Plus it sounds like a ‘bumper sticker’ of sorts. A declaration, a slogan if you will!
Buddyhead: It reminds me of a graveyard in here in Los Angeles called “Hollywood Forever” with the infinity symbol underneath it.
Josh: Yeah, we took pictures there.
Andy: For me when we finished the record it just didn’t seem like a SLAVES record. It had similar things happening, but it felt new.
Josh: We had been talking about changing the name for the last year and the opportunity hadn’t arisen.
Andy: It got old having to explain this concept of “slavery.” A lot of people took it too literally.
Josh: Now no one sticks a “The” in front of PLEASURE FOREVER.
Buddyhead: Weren’t there some legal reasons to the name change as well? Didn’t Sub Pop want you to change, because there was some other band that already owned the name?
Dave: Yeah, there was some punk band from Los Angeles called “The Slaves.” And other bands were using it too. Realizing that, it just seemed prosaic. We figured it was high time to come up with something better.
Buddyhead: You don’t have a bass player live, is there a reason for that?
Dave: Andy played bass on a couple of songs. We have the little notations of who did what in the cd booklet with the lyrics. So everyone can follow along with the home game. We just have never been able to find the right person for the job, and Andy plays great bass lines on his keyboard. However, I would really like to have a bass player, because it helps the drummer out so much. I don’t think it’s as much of a concern to the other guys as it is for me. Ideally, I’d like to have Martin from Sunshine play with us. He’s fits our program to a ‘T’.
Buddyhead: There seemed to be a dormant time for you guys. From the last Slaves EP to the Pleasure Forever LP, and in that time there is a real evident growth in sound and song writing. The name change seems to fit that time period perfectly. Slave to infinite pleasure!
Josh: A lot of it was timing. We didn’t live in the same city for the first two Slaves records. The first one we recorded in our practice space to be used as a demo, but we ended up putting out 4 of the songs. The second one we sort of wrote and recorded that one in about a week. They were experiments so to speak. With the new record we were able to write a bunch of songs and play them for a long time. Half the songs we’ve been playing on tour for the last two or three years. We’ve finally had a chance to get in the studio and take our time. Well, relatively speaking compared to the other records.
Buddyhead: What made you want to record with Tim Green, other than he’s your friend?
Dave: He has a good knack for what he’s doing, his rates are cheap, and he’s really easy to work with. That’s our main reason. He has input, but he’s not a producer or anything like that. He knows where we’re coming from.
Josh: He pulls really good performances out of us.
Andy: He doesn’t let us get away with some bullshit! If it’s not up to par he can tell and that definitely helps. And he isn’t too heavy handed either, and on top of that he has great ideas. I’m a big fan of his music anyway. He played on our record too.
Buddyhead: Did he have a lot of input on the new songs on the album? Arrangements, that sort of thing?
Andy: From an engineering standpoint, yes. But, we arranged everything.
Josh: A lot of his suggestions pertained mostly to vocals and over-dubbing stuff. We would go through the song, he would critique the performance. When we would do extra stuff, we were generally improvising or we would have an idea of what we wanted to do and he’d say ‘that sounds good” or “maybe you should do something else”. It’s like having an outsider there that knows where you are coming from and can give you helpful suggestions.
Buddyhead: And he’s a fan and friend right? So he knew exactly what was happening. Haven’t you toured with The Champs before?
Dave: Yeah, we’ve done some shows with em. We’re talking about doing some shows with em in Europe for the first part of our tour over there. They’re great, even if our music is different.
Josh: But I think they’re on the same wave length with what were doing. We’re both drawing from all these influences of these bands we’re really into and making music that we like out of it. We both sound very different, but we’re both coming from the same place.
Buddyhead: Everything from the artwork on the record to the name to the quotes inside the record: speaking of orgies and what not: are suggesting something. What’s the word from the horses mouth on that?
Dave: Well, I didn’t actually formulate any explanation for the cover until just recently. I started to notice records, artwork, etc. that seemed to have more of a conceptual feeling. There’s an architecture to the design. There’s certain records I appreciate on different levels than other things where the cover art is in a room. The main thing I was thinking about was that there are plenty of records throughout history that have been interesting to me at a concept level where the songs are all about a time period, a mood, etc. The artwork creates this architecture around the music and there’s something about having the ‘depth of field’ on a record where you can see an image and there’s activity and it’s occurring in a space that becomes interesting. There’s lots of older records that have been interesting on those terms to me. What we were going for, with the artwork, was to evoke baccanalia. To have those kinds of ideas explaining what’s going on with the music: themes and what not. Giving something odd and unusual to invited people to spend time looking at it and think about it. When I was growing up, I was really into staring at the cover of a record while listening to it, and try to find stuff that was going on there.
Andy: “Hotel California” a classic!
Buddyhead: Subhumans “The Day The Country Died”, I used to stare at that for days!
Dave: There’s lots of records that are so much fun to look at. As far as what I wanted to do was create something that had a lot going on and had interesting things happening.
Josh: We also wanted to do something that was over the top! Something bigger than ourselves. Bigger than a band in our position, with our budget could possibly do. Just make the best record cover we could. Regardless what it cost… which goes with the music. There are limitations with time and money but we pushed it as far as it could go.
Andy: The quotes reflect the lyrical themes of reaching for decadence and the sides of the coin: both sides of the coin in reaching for decadence. A lot of it is things I noticed around me. What people were doing around me. Very 20′s like behavior. But seeing the 30′s looming… in a historical perspective. Just knowing there’s going to be a crash… and that people can’t substantiate themselves on dust for too long, before it gets out of control. But at the same time not looking down at people who are reaching for decadence. You know what I mean? Almost just being a part of that process in some ways, and exploring those things.
Buddyhead: We’ve known each other for some time and I remember you speaking of the lyrical content of observing San Francisco, your friends, and the group household you live in.
Josh: In a way the music, the cover, all of it, are a celebration of all that. Even though it’s “dangerous.”
Dave: That’s what we do or try to do or find interesting is the ‘teetering’ of all that! Like a glass teetering at the edge of a table… is it going to stay or fall??
Andy: But it’s not interesting when people fall into “the abyss!”. The longer people teeter on the precipice, the more inspirational they are to our band! And even trying to evoke that type of behavior in my life… pushing it but not pushing it to the point where·
Buddyhead: So are you voyeurs?
Andy: Not me. Some of the themes on the record are definitely autobiographical. Observing my own behavior while participating at the same time. A lot of times in a heavy, heady situation… like “okay, what am I doing?” watching myself interact with people. Being able separate out more.
Buddyhead: You want to get specific?
Andy: No, any kind of excessive activity.
Buddyhead: Like what? Lets make things interesting here. Let’s talk about it!
Andy: Like doing drugs, conversations, sex, you know?
Buddyhead: Yeah I know, but not everyone else knows. Explain.
Andy: Just pushing the boundaries.
Buddyhead: You’re talking about some of the themes, lyrics, etc. being autobiographical? Let’s hear about it!
Andy: Well like the song “Bullets” is about me doing drugs and knowing that there had to be a point where it was getting out of hand. The song “Tomorrow Forever” is about my best friend who I’ve observed over the years getting wrapped up in drugs. “Goodnight” is about sexual boundaries, sexual limits, falling in love and wanting to fuck for hours on end! And seeking out people you know? I like to fuck you know. I think that should be expressed in music. I’m sick of bands that deny sexuality. Also trying to be as colorful and creative with it. San Francisco really fosters sexual creativity. It’s a very sexually creative town. That was a big influence on my thoughts, actions, writings and observations.
Buddyhead: It’s good to hear sexual music in a “scene” where many of our peers and contemporaries, have come from or evolved from so to speak… so much of it is so shallow, superficial, retro, and boring. Not much of it has a sexual feel or appeal to it. To me music like jazz and rock n’ roll is sexual music. Not just music that effects a person from the waist up, but from the feet up! The whole body. That’s what I get from Pleasure Forever music· from and for the libido and beyond!
Dave: Jerry Lee Lewis! Elvis Presley!
Josh: For us it’s about art. Music as art. I would consider us artists. A lot of bands are like “hey lets start a band because you know we wanna play songs!” for us it’s an extension of all of us coming together, it’s an emotional thing.
Andy: And conversely a lot of artists don’t consider music to be art and I think that’s bullshit! And I think that there’s so many people in fucking art schools who have so much pretentious crap crammed into their heads over the years that they’re limited. People who go to art school go to be taught how to be fucking creative. If you don’t have it you’ll never have it, trust me!
Buddyhead: I couldn’t agree with you 100% more.
Dave: It’s really interesting, it’s really neat there’s a reaction to our record and our band that people say that its “sensual” music. Cuz I don’t know if we think about it, but a lot of reviews and people have been saying there’s a “sex theme” happening. I don’t know if that’s cuz of the artwork, or lyrics or what. It seems as if one of those weird things, cuz you can’t deliberately do that. It just comes out of what we do which is why the name is appropriate much more so than Slaves.
Andy: I think it’s something that naturally comes from us. I don’t think it’s like “let’s make a sex band or whatever.” I’ve played shows that were visceral and not very sexual and people are like “that was so sexual” or like “you guys are so sexual” maybe that’s just us.
Buddyhead: You’re talking about being a sexual person and your art being an extension of yourself… so it makes sense that people would get that out of your music!
Dave: My art is pornography. Haha. People are masturbating on my bread and butter!
Andy: I hope. I hope someone does masturbate to our record!
Buddyhead: Getting back to the “sex thing” have any of you guys ever been in an orgy?
Dave: Been in one? No. I’ve always wanted to be. That’s another thing, for me growing up in the 70′s and observing that kind of culture was very interesting cuz I’ve always thought how amazing it was. I’m a product of the tail end of the “sexual revolution”. I guess more like the beginning of it and then growing up through all that and those times. It seems as if you’d lose a sense of things. There’s a lot of ego involved in sex, where people need to be expressing themselves and considering themselves as something that’s going on. So an orgy setting is pretty strange to be in because you’re not one of two, you are in this big deal. It seems like an interesting challenge. I’ve always been into the idea of possibly transcending yourself and where you are…
Andy: Transcending your boundaries.
Dave: That was the thing with the VSS that we were working on. The beginning of that. Realizing that we could try and do something that was an out of yourself experience. Getting into those trance moments. That was one of the first things we focused on with Slaves. Songs that had more repetition to them and trance like elements, droning, etc. I think we’ve honed things a bit and worked on other angles of interesting matter. So anyway, as far as an orgy, it’s an interesting concept but I’m sure a lot of people like to talk about it but…
Josh: It seems really contrived!
Andy: I’ve had an impromptu orgy of the fact that more than 2 people having sex in the same room at the same time and it was not that big of deal really.
Dave: It’s like junior high.
Andy: Seriously, junior high school sex is totally orgiastic! Cuz you and your friend would be fucking girls in some room, some where… Dave: In a car.
Buddyhead: No, we’re talking about sharing the sexual pleasure with more than one person at the same time. No “square pegs” shit!
Andy: But there would be swapping… swapping out!
Josh: But it used to be more a part of culture. Something that happened. Now it seems like a lot of the people that are really interested in it are goofballs.
Andy: That is such a goofy fetish scene. It’s bullshit. There is a place in San Francisco called “The Powerhouse” where you can watch people fuck. And people go there to fuck in front of people.
Dave: That’s all the people working in cubicle jobs and things. Boring people searching for outside things to make their lives interesting.
Josh: I think if it happened or it just “popped up” it would be fun. But to try and put it together when its not a thing that goes on would be kinda dumb.
Andy: Impromptu is definitely more interesting, more natural.
Josh: Cuz you know once you’re having sex you can get into a lot of stuff you know? Haha. Once things get going you can be talked into shit. But to like plan on it ahead of time is bullshit. It’s more about the moment.
Buddyhead: We weren’t talking about planning it! We were talking about if you’ve ever been involved in an orgy or orgies?????
Andy: There needs to be a distinction made between contrived things and things occurring naturally as well. And for me that’s an important thing. Spontaneity. That’s what makes it exciting.
Buddyhead: Speaking of spontaneity, how do you guys write your songs? Are they taken out of “jamming”?
Andy: I get a lot of ideas when I’m having sex. No, I do only spontaneous sex.
Buddyhead: So sex acts as a muse? So when you’re “gettin humpy” you come up with ideas and parts for songs? Haha! “Stay right there… I got a really good idea for a bass part… No wait don’t move”… Haha!
Andy: Sometimes when you’re laying there and you’ve just had sex, your thoughts are really… it’s like crowley… the method of divination through tantric sex.
Buddyhead: So she’s like “what are you thinking about” and you reply “a guitar part baby”?
Andy: I get a lot of ideas like melodies and parts in my head and I’ve trained myself to remember them so that when I do have a chance to actually make the song happen I can do it. But that is definitely a time when ideas flow forth for me.
Buddyhead: I know for me that after sex there’s always a moment of clarity that invites thought.
Andy: Yeah, it’s that opening of a window for even a minute. It’s clear and easy, more than taking drugs , more than anything for me.
Buddyhead: Do you guys collaborate on songs or is there a main writer? What are the nuts and bolts of the process?
Josh: We all sort of write our own parts. We all bring in ideas. Sometimes we start jamming and things will come out that we like. Or we’ll work something in that we wrote while jamming. It just sort of works organically. There’s some songs that Andy has come in with that are worked out completely.
Dave: We work on all those things for a while. It takes a long time to write songs for us.
Josh: We all get pretty involved in all the aspects of writing the songs.
Andy: A lot of marination. Like the song “Bullets” is one of the first songs we had written and it’s just coming out now.
Josh: This is the third time we have recorded it.
Andy: We are constantly reworking things.
Buddyhead: Do you think Sonic Youth influenced your playing in bands like the VSS and Pleasure Forever, that are a bit non-conventional?
Josh: Definitely. Sonic Youth introduced me to tuning the guitar different from the standard tuning. I don’t currently, but on one Slaves tour I tuned with my guitar in some made up tuning of mine: lot’s of double strings tuned to the same note a la Sonic Youth. They are also really into the percussive sounds you can get out of guitars, and I’m into that.
Buddyhead: It seems when most people hear Pleasure Forever, they hear obscure rock bands from Germany or some shit, I hear the Doors… now the Doors did some crazy shit in their day, do you have anything that you guys have done that can stand up to Morrison and Co.?
Josh: One time in Denver, I got so drunk I passed out before the show and they had to wake me up. I could barely stand up and couldn’t play any songs. Dave screamed at me from behind the drum set. I lifted my effects pedals up by the cord and couldn’t figure out what they were. I turned my amp on and off and continually unplugged myself. Someone thought it was performance art.
Buddyhead: What about as far as ethics and attitude, even on a mainstream level, Sonic Youth has always done things very much the way they wanted to. What affect did seeing that at an early stage have on you?
Josh: I feel I can relate to them, the way they operate, and I’m not necessarily into a lot of their records and projects now. I don’t know if I’ve consciously or subconsciously drawn from their attitudes and actions to form my own, but I see them as smart people and artists operating in a context and an industry that’s not necessarily filled with the brightest bulbs, and they are using that to their advantage: aligning themselves with similarly-minded people and working within the mainstream to put out an alternative product. It’s awesome.
Buddyhead: This question is a little off the subject, but how did the Sub Pop ep/single come about? Was that recorded at the same time as the album?
Josh: The same time as the LP. It was a way to release a single and alert people of the name change before we went on tour. Something to sell on tour too. It’s a limited ep. We went on tour and sometimes we were slated as Slaves and sometimes Pleasure Forever. We just wanted something to get people in tune with what we were up to now. So when the record came out people weren’t “who is Pleasure Forever?”
Buddyhead: I got a question for you Dave. You were formerly a guitar player before the VSS correct?
Dave: Yes.
Buddyhead: How long had you been playing before joining the VSS? When did you start playing drums? When you joined the VSS or years before? Clarify.
Dave: About a week maybe? In this practice space that I had been using, just playing with some people, before there was a drum set and I’d just go and play. That’s how I knew Andy was so good, because he’d come and played with us a few times. We’d just make up stuff. Switch instruments. I thought that playing the drums was really fun and guitar had gotten boring for me. I’d played for about 10 years and it just wasn’t the right release.
Josh: Dave didn’t even have a drum set until we started the VSS.
Dave: Yeah, I just went out and bought one that week. Angel Hair broke up cuz the drummer had moved and then we were all talking and said “Lets start a new band”. It needed a drummer and I said “I’ll do it!”. It’s been a learning process and I’m really glad that everyone has been patient with that too. It’s a pretty hard thing to learn.
Buddyhead: All the lyrical content, is that just you Andy?
Andy: Yes. Pretty much.
Buddyhead: Rock superstardom, as in MTV, and Volkswagen commercials… do you think that the mainstream public could “get” a band like yours?
Josh: Well, I’ve thought about this. I believe the only way we can get huge is by a shift in the public consciousness: someone just needs to decide that hey, this is the kind of music to listen to. I know we’re a good band and that we have a good record, but that’s just not what it’s about at the superstardom level. But really, my future plan for the band is a new great record, a long-form video, lots of touring. Keep on keepin’ on.
Buddyhead: What’s next for you guys. Tour, tour, tour?
Dave: Two months in the US. 2 months in Europe. Then hopefully Japan, Australia and if Paul Drake gets his way, South America… and everywhere else he wants to go, hahahaha. It’s really great he’s so into us. We’ve known him for a long time. He toured with the VSS, we know him from Colorado. He used to put on shows there, etc. really cool guy. He’s just like “I wanna go here and here and here”… it’s funny.
Josh: He’s really taken us under his wing.
Dave: He’s working on shows in Russia, Poland, Iceland, you name it.
Josh: We’ve always gotten along with him and he really likes the record. So it’s great for us. And he does a really good job!
Dave: Oh and we’re gonna play with Bluebird this fall in San Francisco.
Buddyhead: I like to close interviews with this question because I loved reading interviews when I was younger and bands would tell what other bands they liked, current or older. What have you guys been listening to lately?
Josh: Queens of the Stone Age.
Andy: Aphex Twin. I finally broke down. I resisted electronic music for years. It’s everywhere in San Francisco and it’s so in your face.
Dave: I like the White Stripes.
Josh: Yeah the new record is really good.
Dave: They’re hitting a saturation point though.
Josh: We’ve been listening to a lot of Mark Lanegan in the van. The last Primal Scream record. I’ve been dropping a lot of money on music lately.
Dave: There is always Flipper and Black Flag too.
Buddyhead: Any bands on tour you’ve seen and liked a lot?
Josh: Love Life.
Andy: Soiled Doves. They used to be the Vogue from Seattle.
Dave: Hey I found a book called “soiled doves”. I figured it out.
Josh: Yeah it was an “old west” term for hookers.
Dave: 16 horsepower.
Buddyhead: Another last question… what’s your take on the internet?
Andy: I use it for half an hour a day at the library. I limit my time on it! I use it for email· get in touch with people, and internet pornography!
Josh: I’ve seen people printing pornography at the library.
Andy: I’m pretty loose about it.
Dave: The best thing is when people make fun of the internet. They make fun of technology. It’s pretty stupid.
Andy: There’s a weird backlash happening. People that want to remain antiquated.
Josh: It’s a tool, use it for whatever works.
Andy: What do we think about Buddyhead being an online mag? It’s good. You can reach more people and save more resources. Like with magazines. I don’t keep them around.
Dave: It’s interesting because it’s a medium that hasn’t found it sole purpose. People always think with new media it’s gonna be one thing, but it doesn’t usually end up that way. People thought television was going to be the home education device. Obviously it didn’t’ fulfill that promise. As far as the internet is concerned, it’s main use is for immediate communication… to talk to people and for people to leave their own mark. That’s why web boards are really useful· even though it’s a narcissistic avenue.
Josh: It’s screwed because we live in San Francisco, a huge city. It’s different if you live in the middle of nowhere. We have more direct options.
Buddyhead: Ok, real last question… what’s the dumbest thing you’ve ever done… and don’t say this interview… because I’m not hammered anymore.
Josh: Say to a Mormon, “Like those crazy Mormons!”
Buddyhead: Did the Mormon get pissed?
Josh: He said, “I’m a Mormon,” and I said, “Sure, right.”
Buddyhead: Did the Mormon kick your ass?
Josh: Are you kidding? Have you seen me? I’m six-foot-three and weigh two hundred pounds. Plus it was during class in ninth-grade English.
Buddyhead: Yeah, but Mormons travel in packs don’t they? Like, if you’re a Mormon Father, you have like 14 wives right?· and probably another 29 kids… so that’s a lot of people. That’s a couple of football teams of Mormons ready to kick your ass… Am I thinking of someone other than mormons?
Josh: I don’t know anything about the Mormons. And, yes you are, you’re thinking about Mormons.
Buddyhead: OK, that’s a nice way to end it I think.
Josh: Tell that to the Mormons.
Buddyhead: I still think they’d kick your ass, there are just too many of them.
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